Electrical Failure just before Roundup

[johber41]

Hello buggy family. Today was special! Today my buggy took a pshaw and stopped charging right before Roundup. What appeared to be a battery storage problem to me has turned into a failed generator. It is the original, so I guess I should not be complaining too much. But, COME ON, right before the Roundup. YouTube afforded me the tests I needed to determine if I had a voltage regulator problem or a bad generator. I tested the generator and watched it turn with a tad of 6v touched to the D+. It passed so I bought a voltage regulator. Nothing improved. I should be showing 7.2 v at the regulator output but instead it just mirrored the battery life at 6.4 v. I finally pulled the new regulator off and tested the output of the generator. The brushes looked good but I only got 0.2 v on my volt meter. Ordered the new one…$107.00 at Oreilly, and started pulling the engine. I am determined to make it to the roundup, car in working order. Don’t want the Doom Buggy award back! NO THANKS! Stay tuned….

[Bill K]

Hey John
Do whatever you have to to have that car running in time for the Roundup. We are all really looking forward to seeing you and Karen again.

I hope you are not pulling the engine to change the generator. I don't think that is necessary.

[Bill K]

I just figured it out: DMV hacked your electrical system.

[johber41]

My engine is tucked so far under the back of the car that it does require the engine down to get the carb moved and get the fan unbolted. I was able to service the generator, brushes etc...while the engine is in place, but even that was done with mirrors and just feeling around. It's been a real challenge just getting a generator, still waiting on it. In 1966 the original builder, my neighbor, had the body built extra long to accommodate a corvair 6 cylinder. It's great for keeping everything out of the weather but I don't drive it in the rain anyway.....it's a mechanical challenge in this crazy heat for sure!

[johber41]

By the way Bill....if all the wheels fall off and the engine burns, we are going to be there car or not. We will just start bumming rides! Miss just seeing everyone and enjoying the different versions of this fun car!

[Dave W]

Hey John,

Just a little motivation to get your buggy running for the Roundup. You never know who you may meet up with in the Texas Hill Country!!! Maybe Bill has a route established which will take us through Bandera!!!

[johber41]

Thanks Dave.....you do have a nac for inspiring the best in folks! Crazy as it sounds Dave, that troublesome buggy breakdown ended up with you and I interned in buggy folklore forever.....it was our 15 minutes of fame! Can't wait to see what this next Roundup will bring.

Ps: what's with you hanging on to the pic of Rodeo Rose. You know you can go blind like that!

[Bill K]

For those of you who may not know the story of "Rodeo Rose", I'd like to let you in on this.

At a previous Roundup Cruise John started having trouble with his Buggy. We were near Bandera so Dave volunteered to follow John into Bandera and wait for a trailer to come pick up John's Buggy.

While they were waiting they spotted this "Beautiful" Cowgirl riding her horse toward them. So, as Dave tells the story, John rips off his shirt to show his upper physique and hit the ground doing push ups to make a big impression on the Cowgirl.

Well, when she got close it turned out she was an 80-year-old worn out, and not-so-beautiful lady who looked like she had too many nights in the bars.

And, thus was born the now famous story of "Rodeo Rose".

Now, Dave or John, please feel free to jump in and correct any mistakes I may have made in this great story.

[johber41]

Very close in your brief description Bill, but I must interject.......yes, from far away it did appear as though we were being visited by an angel right out of all the old southwest cowboy movies and tv shows. As Dave shoved me aside and hurried to present himself to this visitor right out of Rawhide, or Death Valley Days, I noticed via my keen police observation techniques that this was not going to be th visitor Dave had hoped, I attempted to save Dave, but he could not be restrained. It was Dave doing the push-ups. I tried to help Dave, him being so much younger and athletic, but he had to learn the lesson on his own. I do owe Dave for hanging back, Ken too, but that rodeo clown experience was a true lesson in not judging a book far away, or something like that! I wonder if that pistol she was sporting was real? I wonder what would have happened to Dave if he did go two step dancing with her?

[johber41]

Got the engine out and the generator removed from the fan shroud. Got the new parts in but the rebuilt unit has a sticker on it that states it does not allow a bench test. I like to see if the thing is working prior to re-installing everything. I might take it by a local rebuilder and see if he can test it for output!

[Dave W]

Ahh... Brother John, I always said you would be a great fiction writer, and the above ramble proves my point. As our current US President would say "Fake News"!!!

Bill, you have correctly documented the Bandera experience, except for the fine details. For example, John did one arm push ups to impress Rodeo Rose. I am not sure if it was 12 volt envy or the stress associated with the "Doom Duggy" award, but it was the first time I witnessed "Love at First Site".

Looking forward to great weekend and so glad John and Karen will be joining us!!!

[johber41]

Looking forward to seeing you Dave and Miss Christy! You better start thinking about the dementia medicine Dave.....your memory is not only fading, it's a bit warped! Ah...good times, good times!

[johber41]

My car repairs are not living up to what I had expected. Installed the rebuilt generator and it has no output. What the &@?!. Going to have to pull the engine down one more time and seek out a better rebuild. All the polarizing etc has failed. You guys were right .......generators &@£*¥#%!!!!!

[Ken]

Did you polarize the new generator?

About Polarization
Why do generators need to be polarized? Generators need some magnetism to get started. This "residual" magnetism remains in the field pole pieces even after the engine has stopped. The next time the generator starts up, the residual magnetism creates a small voltage in the Armature windings. Not enough to charge the battery, but enough to allow the field windings to draw current. As the field current increases, the pole pieces create even more magnetism. That makes even more voltage in the armature, and the cycle continues until the generator is capable of producing maximum output.

Anytime a generator is disconnected from the system, there is a possibility the residual magnetism may have decreased to the point where it can no longer get the generator started producing voltage. In the case of a new generator or one which has been miss treated, the residual may even be of the wrong direction (north and south poles reversed).

Polarization is a simple process used to restore the field pole residual magnetism and ensure the magnetic direction is correct.

[Ken]

Here's a thread on the procedure.

Testing / Polarizing Generator

[Ken]

My car repairs are not living up to what I had expected. Installed the rebuilt generator and it has no output. What the &@?!. Going to have to pull the engine down one more time and seek out a better rebuild. All the polarizing etc has failed. You guys were right .......generators &@£*¥#%!!!!!

Oh sorry John, just reread your post and see you did mention the polarizing subject.

[Heathwerner]

John, I just saw your post. I have a generator on an engine I built for just the fun of it that you are more than welcome to borrow. Hell, you can barrow the whole engine if you want. Whatever it takes to get you to Kerrville. Im right here around the corner from you to help you with whatever you need. Call Me!
Heath

[Heathwerner]

Hey John, I just thought of something that night help. I know that if your generator/alternator light on your dash doesnt work your alternator will not charge. The light actually excites it to start charging and thats when the light goes off. Im pretty sure this also goes for generators. Somebody please correct me if Im wrong.
Heath

[johber41]

Hey Heath....I read about the dash light....I have never had one but I had a charging system. Who knows what they did on the initial build in 1966. I'll call you later today.....might need to use your generator.....a rebuilder in Baycliff has my original unit and he is evaluating it. I think the one I bought from oreillys was just a bad rebuild. I tried to get it to motor , turn when power added to D+ but it will not. They even have a sticker on it that reads the unit cannot be bench tested. When I asked the rebuilder in Baycliff about the sticker, he just laughed and wondered if they put that on there after someone wrecked it and brought it back. I'm pulling the motor around lunchtime tomorrow and then going to have the rebuilt unit checked by the rebuilder.

Interesting enough, when I start the car, it puts off interference that stops my smart tv from receiving it's wifi signal. So it's generating something, just not the right thing. Thanks for the bump Heath, and thanks for the info Ken.....I did check the unit and tried to polarize it several times. I think the unit is just rebuilt wrong.

The story continues....

[Heathwerner]

No problem John. Just let me know what I can do to help. Thats crazy it interferes with your smart TV. Are you sure you dont have a Flux Capacitor instead of generator?

[Bill K]

I put two O'Reilly rebuilt generators in my car and neither worked.

So,I bought a Bosch generator and I was fixed.

[johber41]

I'm with you on that Bill.....the Oreillys unit had an extra lead for a brush ground that the professionals a A Alternators and Starters have never seen before. They tested the rebuilt unit and could not get it to do anything. I took it back for a refund and found an exact match for my old unit at Standard Auto Parts, now called Auto Plus or something like that. Will pick it up tomorrow. The future is getting brighter!

[Bill K]

The future is indeed getting brighter. The Roundup is just around the corner and we are all looking forward to seeing you and Karen again.

And, I'm sure hoping this generator gets you up and running.

[johber41]

My generator came in to Auto Plus, formerly Standard Auto Parts, and to my displeasure it looked just like the Oreillys rebuild with a third lead for a brush ground. With the Roundup just ahead, I decided to take it home and try it.....nothing worked. I called the company that rebuilt it and learned that the third lead was an improvement to the old model which used to union the brush ground and the D+ inside the case. The online mechanic told me mount the brush ground along with the D+ on the voltage reg and then to bench test the unit to see if it would motor and it did!!! Thank God, it's now in the car and working great. My it's charging about 6.5 volts at idle and then along with any throttle it goes as high as 10volts. My lights are brighter than they have ever boon and my speedometer is like a cabin light on the dash. See you guys in about a week!

[Bill K]

So glad to hear you will will Rolling With the Roundup.

[Aquabuggy]

Glad to hear your back up & running! See ya next weekend

[johber41]

Spoke too soon.....back to the lab, had a fire under my dash that reduced amp gauge to a ball of molten metal and plastic. Nice little burn for sure.....have most of the wires pulled down but I am struggling with finding my tail light circuit. I need to figure out why the generator is flooding the system with all that amperage. My buggy is just not used to an efficient power source.....I'm sure my mechanical follies is wearing thin on readers......we will be there, maybe without the car!

That's enough of that!